tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3915987055785965548.post2371224804739411543..comments2023-10-07T05:35:26.974-07:00Comments on A Baha'i Perspective of Islam: Some Old Charges for a New ReligionSusan Maneckhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/12808387897564447194noreply@blogger.comBlogger32125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3915987055785965548.post-46342895374176692982011-07-10T00:45:25.093-07:002011-07-10T00:45:25.093-07:00"it is the provven, pure, uncorrupted religio..."it is the provven, pure, uncorrupted religion of God."<br />Lol, if it was uncorrupted Muslims wouldn't even kill each other half as often as they do.Daniel De Molhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11736929349071460221noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3915987055785965548.post-76523067338631389292010-06-13T21:28:04.680-07:002010-06-13T21:28:04.680-07:00Dear Mark,
The Semitic root word for God is El. ...Dear Mark, <br /><br />The Semitic root word for God is El. While Jesus was on the cross He says Eli, Eli which means "my God, my God." The word you are thinking of is Eloh which is very closely related but is usually found in the plural form as Elohim in the Hebrew Bible, though it takes singular verbs. Allah and Eloh are Arabic/Hebrew cognates both of which are derived from El. <br /><br />warmest, SusanSusan Maneckhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12808387897564447194noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3915987055785965548.post-31024580330980388842009-12-26T05:01:50.661-08:002009-12-26T05:01:50.661-08:00Susan, I'm happy to see your blog which Moro s...Susan, I'm happy to see your blog which Moro sent to me. You can see mine at http://worldpeach.blogspot.com/ <br />I was recently deeply involved on Catholic Forums and learned a lot about teacing and what peoples attitudes are!<br />One person tried to say Allah was not Yahweh.<br />I said "Remember when Jesus cried Eloi Eloi. A more academic transliteration would be Iláhí Iláhí. Both mean My God! My God!"<br />Another person who was a convert from Islam to Christianity said: "“The Isa al-Masih of the Quran (or Isa ibn Maryam as he is also called) is not the same Person as Jesus Christ (or Messiah) in the Bible.<br />The Quran associates the two, yet Jesus had always been called " Yasou' " by Arabic-speaking Christians prior to Mohammad, as is to this day.”<br />But I disputed that too. Languages vary, but the Holy Spirt does not. It brought the Book to Mary and it brought the Book to Muhammad.<br />Praise God we have a new Living Book once again!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3915987055785965548.post-70954509458454513172009-09-18T18:51:23.957-07:002009-09-18T18:51:23.957-07:00Hi James,
Are you the same person who posts from...Hi James, <br /><br />Are you the same person who posts from Mumbai on another list? <br /><br />In regards to hadith collections, I'm not sure that because some hadiths can be regarded as authentic that they should all be treated in this manner. Most Baha'i hadiths come from Shi'ite collections and I doubt if that is where the ones you have in mind come from. I think all hadiths are somewhat tenuous by their very nature, but I would hope that someday we can develop a new science of hadith using modern methodologies to determine what is likely authentic. But I don't really want to get bogged down in Shi'ite/Sunni disputes regarding what constitutes an authentic hadith. As Baha'u'llah said, “The eye of divine mercy casteth its glance upon all that is past. It behooveth us to mention them only in favourable terms, for they do not contradict that which is essential.”<br /><br />Baha'u'llah also says: <br /><br />“Be anxiously concerned with the needs of the age ye live in, and centre your deliberations on its exigencies and requirements”<br /><br />As for your criticism of Baha'u'llah message in relationship to Islam, I think if you look at history you will find the same objections and criticisms were made by the Jews in relation to Christ. It is always as the Qur'an says: "And Joseph came to you aforetime with clear tokens, but ye ceased not to doubt of the message with which He came to you, until, when He died, ye said, 'God will by no means raise up a Messenger after Him." Qur'an 30:34<br /><br />ma salamaat, SusanSusan Maneckhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12808387897564447194noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3915987055785965548.post-59945941563714534692009-09-12T23:17:00.719-07:002009-09-12T23:17:00.719-07:00serve His higher Cause. but I must clarify, that w...serve His higher Cause. but I must clarify, that when the prophet Muhammad, may the peace and blessings of Allah(swt) be upon him, spoke in his prophecies of the Last Days, he prophesies much more about his Ummah than you related. if you accept prophecies such as the one you did, and many other prophecies and hadiths I have seen Baha'is quote and even their founders and prophets quote, if you accept these hadiths, then you have no choice but to subsequently accept atleast related hadiths. you cannot pick and choose what suits your theory adn reject everything else. the prophet said that in the LAST DAYS, it would be his Ummah, who would join the Messiah, who would ride under HIS(Muhammad's) banner. simultaenously, he alo prophesied that there wouldbe 30 imposters who would arise out of his Ummah, meaning Muslims, who would claim themselves prophets, but that "He is the last in the line of the prophets of God no messenger will come after him", and thus, it is related that they would all be Muslims, and apostate out of the religion of God, in order to create a new religion, and pronounce themselves prophets, and you know the rest.<br /><br />secondly, you would also have to accept the authentic hadiths and the Qur'anic verses that state he was the final messenger of God. the seal of the prophets thing is very much so over emphasized today, yes, but it is nonetheless true. how righteous is it for a man to come, to claim all of the prophecies, all of the words God Himself spoke in His Qur'an, to have been allegorical, and to not mean what the prophet, the Companions, nad God and the world always have known them to mean, just so he can fit himself into the equation? I pray you do not think because you "accept" Muhammad's prophethood, that I am burdoned to accept Bahaullah's, or any Muslim, or to speak kindly of him, because in essence, Baha'ullah is as the prophet said, a wolf in sheeps clothing. he says, yes, Muhammad is the messenger of Allah, no, a Manifestation of God Himself! were he to say, "He is God", by Allah, Muhammad would have told the truth. but yet he the whole time is deceiving both Muslims and Baha'is alike, because he attempts to nullify the prophet of God's Message and the Word of God Himself. yes, he is God's Mesenger, adn I do not want to abrogate his message, but do not listen to or obey anything he says, because this message I have brought, in contradiction of his, is better, though it is a complete contradiction of the admitted Message of Allah Himself, glorified and exalted be He.<br /><br />who delivered Baha'ullah's "Book"? or did he conjure it up on his own? aman's opinions are not Godly, no matter how educated, or worldly elegant. Holiness adn Godliness can only come direct from God. did the angel Gabriel deliver his book?<br /><br />in all honesty, I have, after studying the Bahai faith, developed, atleast when compared wit hthis, or i nthe context of "inspired prophets or reformers or whatever such people", a profound new respect for that Mirza Ghulam Ahmad guy, though he too, falsely, claimed himself to be the Messiah, atleasst he remained true to Islam, in the most major sense. I will never invoke allah's curse for that man again.<br /><br />I suggest to the Baha'is to acept Submission to the Will of God through Peace as their religion, it is the provven, pure, uncorrupted religion of God. Salaam.Unknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13801713754985277996noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3915987055785965548.post-74994075629344706112009-09-12T23:16:34.784-07:002009-09-12T23:16:34.784-07:00Susan, I have a few things to say. first, I'm ...Susan, I have a few things to say. first, I'm gladt you have a generally positive outlook on Islam. I am also glad you are one who acknowledges the prophet Muhammad(SAW). and that you seemingly study the teachings exclusive to Islam, atleast originally, and fully, such as the our testimonial before birth, as to the question of "Am I not your Lord", and this being the reason for each and every soul's yearning to know God, and their nature to tend to believe in our Creator, and to...Unknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13801713754985277996noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3915987055785965548.post-22167399154961654932009-03-28T10:40:00.000-07:002009-03-28T10:40:00.000-07:00I must admit, I avoid such sites. People there are...I must admit, I avoid such sites. People there are not at all interested in investigating the truth for themselves and they will only condemn the Baha'i Faith as a offshoot of Islam.Susan Maneckhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12808387897564447194noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3915987055785965548.post-66475927144246078532009-03-04T13:22:00.000-08:002009-03-04T13:22:00.000-08:00I highly reccomend those who wish to defend the Pr...I highly reccomend those who wish to defend the Prophethood of Muhammed to go to www.jihadwatch.org . It is rife with blindness and hatred of Islam and the Prophet. As far as I know, I am the only Baha'i on the site. It's difficult defending the Prophet on my own as my knowledge is insufficient.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3915987055785965548.post-46694253597274407342009-02-05T11:36:00.000-08:002009-02-05T11:36:00.000-08:00Susan, congratulations, it is a very interesting i...Susan, congratulations, it is a very interesting initiative. Of course only a good prepared person can do well this. I hope you can post other thoughts or stories. I'll initiate the publicity of this blog through links in my internet services, etc. byeHasanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04743543165831294746noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3915987055785965548.post-80663406434028419022009-01-31T15:04:00.000-08:002009-01-31T15:04:00.000-08:00Hello Anonymous,About the Koran 5:51, that's not a...Hello Anonymous,<BR/><BR/>About the Koran 5:51, that's not a very good translation for the Arabic word "awlia" in that sura; "awlia" means that you support non-Muslims in fighting against Muslims or reveal to them secrets (i.e. battle plans) of Muslims, etc. So that passage is not asking Muslims not to befriend the Jews, Christians, Baha'is, etc.<BR/><BR/>Warmest,<BR/><BR/>MasudMasudhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01983086578422848883noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3915987055785965548.post-74608624692513809872009-01-29T15:32:00.000-08:002009-01-29T15:32:00.000-08:00I find this blog most interesting and will be back...I find this blog most interesting and will be back for more. Thank you to all the participants.Jane Gibsonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06644841407967397060noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3915987055785965548.post-29360800655807480512009-01-28T09:46:00.000-08:002009-01-28T09:46:00.000-08:00Dear Muslim-perspective, You're off to an interest...Dear Muslim-perspective, <BR/><BR/>You're off to an interesting start. I look forward to reading more. <BR/><BR/>warmest, SusanSusan Maneckhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12808387897564447194noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3915987055785965548.post-71782059602830497412009-01-28T04:39:00.000-08:002009-01-28T04:39:00.000-08:00I just wanted to inform you that your blog inspire...I just wanted to inform you that your blog inspired me to start my own, entitled "A Muslim's Perspective of the Baha'i Faith." I only have one post so far, but I intend to write on it semi-regularly. Feel free to check it out sometimes.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3915987055785965548.post-48825969175407176732009-01-27T21:17:00.000-08:002009-01-27T21:17:00.000-08:00It's true that so far Baha'is have no suffered the...It's true that so far Baha'is have no suffered the same kind of persecution at the hands of Hindus, Buddhists, Jews or Christians as they have at the hands of Muslims. I would not presume this will not happen in the future, however. Baha'u'llah predicted: <BR/><BR/>"...How great, how very great is the Cause! How very fierce the onslaught of all the peoples and kindreds of the earth. Ere long shall the clamor of the multitude throughout Africa, throughout America, the cry of the European and of the Turk, the groaning of India and China, be heard from far and near. One and all, they shall arise with all their power to resist His Cause. Then shall the knights of the Lord, assisted by His grace from on high, strengthened by faith, aided by the power of understanding, and reinforced by the legions of the Covenant, arise and make manifest the truth of the verse: "Behold the confusion that hath befallen the tribes of the defeated!"<BR/><BR/>Also, I don't think you can judge a religion solely by the way Baha'is are treated. Christianity probably has the worst historical record for persecuting people for their religion. Muslims are being persecuted for their religion in Burma where Buddhist are in the majority. I recently saw on CNN how many of these Muslims escaped on rickety boats to Thailand only to be set out to sea again to die. Hindus have been persecuting Christians in areas like Gujarat. So no religion has a monopoly on either fanaticism or persecution. As Baha'u'llah says: <BR/><BR/>"Religious fanaticism and hatred are a world-devouring fire, whose violence none can quench. The Hand of Divine power can, alone, deliver mankind from this desolating affliction...."<BR/><BR/> (Baha'u'llah, Gleanings from the Writings of Baha'u'llah, p. 288)<BR/><BR/>As for Honor Killings, these are in no way sanction by Islam, but in the past their common amongst a lot of Mediterranean cultures like the Greeks and Italians. <BR/><BR/>I'm not at all sure what you mean by 'what the laws of the Aqdas are about." The Aqdas says nothing whatsoever about cousin marriages or ones brother's wife. <BR/><BR/>And no, I haven't read the Taliban's field manual, but then I haven't read the US military field manual either, nor am I sure than either would be relevant to this blog. <BR/><BR/>I really do not feel constrained to defend the actions of all Muslims. Given the fact that Baha'is are being persecuted in so many Muslim countries that would be rather silly. What I do think we need to defend as Baha'is is the Prophethood of Muahammad, the revelational character of the Qur'an. We also need to honor the contributions which Islam has further civilization and recognize the ways in which it has informed our own religion.Susan Maneckhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12808387897564447194noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3915987055785965548.post-64261712949502651322009-01-27T18:54:00.000-08:002009-01-27T18:54:00.000-08:00Actions speak louder than words..I do not see any ...Actions speak louder than words..I do not see any Jewish ,or Christian,OR Budist,OR Hindu killing amd persecuting Bahais.The moslems have been persecuting amd killing Bahais for over 160 yrs. I taught a muslim family the faith recently..I was ask not to say anything about this,as he was conceerned about his relatives etc.Today this family are at the forfront in their community.I might add I sought out Bahais to learn about the Faith,and the family I met were named Abbas-This entire family had converted,and one of the daughters became a very well known teacher until her death some years ago.I can read about Islam as to what is going on in Europe etc..I have not heard of any Honor Killings on the streets of New York City yet. I am not making my living at teaching islam-Many years ago I gave talks on it to Unitarians etc.Me and my 6 lessons on Islam..Then I did a search as to what many of the laws of Aqudas are about,such as padeophilia,cousin marrige,brothers wife ,homosexuality.Age of concent,marrige -list goes on as you are aware.One more thing here-I have an aquaintance who on her own has gone to one of the most dangerous places on earth,and is looking after women in 2 prisons who had refused to marry the man she was told to.Also establishing schools in villages,but this has stopped ,as all the teachers are being killed ..by thos peace lovin people you are talking about.Did you read the latest field manual of the taliban..What do you make of article 19..? OK-now your turn...Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3915987055785965548.post-52772076991861553562009-01-27T12:59:00.000-08:002009-01-27T12:59:00.000-08:00A very welcome initiative. Much appreciatedA very welcome initiative. Much appreciatedAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3915987055785965548.post-56456717257680936722009-01-26T07:58:00.000-08:002009-01-26T07:58:00.000-08:00If you take the Qur'an as a revelation from God, t...If you take the Qur'an as a revelation from God, then you have to take it all as a revelation from God, (it seems to me). Therefore, while this quote from 5:51 seems to indicate (in some translations) what you said, you have to balance it with other statements from the Qur'an. For example:<BR/><BR/>[60:8] GOD does not enjoin you from befriending those who do not fight you because of religion, and do not evict you from your homes. You may befriend them and be equitable towards them. GOD loves the equitable.<BR/><BR/>[60:9] GOD enjoins you only from befriending those who fight you because of religion, evict you from your homes, and band together with others to banish you. You shall not befriend them. Those who befriend them are the transgressors.<BR/><BR/>So if the Qur'an says you may befriend those who do not fight you because of your religion, that seems to me to be a clarification of God's intent around relations with non-believers. So making allies, as referred to in 5:51 is made clear by 60:9. It's not non-believers, but opponents from among the non-believers that you may not befriend and rely on as allies. To quote Dr. Muzammil Siddiqi, President of the Fiqh Council of North America:<BR/><BR/>The Qur'an does not say that non-Muslims cannot be Muslims' friends, nor does it forbid Muslims to be friendly to non-Muslims. There are many non-Muslims who are good friends of Muslim individuals and the Muslim community. There are also many good Muslims who truly and sincerely observe their faith and are very friendly to many non-Muslims at the same time.<BR/><BR/>Islam teaches us that we should be friendly to all people. Islam teaches us that we should deal even with our enemies with justice and fairness. Allah says in the Qur'an in the beginning of the same Surat Al-Ma dah: "O you who believe! Stand out firmly for Allah as witnesses to fair dealings and let not the hatred of others to you make you swerve to wrong and depart from justice. Be just, that is next to piety. Fear Allah, indeed Allah is well-acquainted with all that you do." (Al-Ma dah 5:8)Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11149956661907218421noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3915987055785965548.post-47053235175943158282009-01-26T00:44:00.000-08:002009-01-26T00:44:00.000-08:00I agree that persecution is worse than murder. Do...I agree that persecution is worse than murder.<BR/> Does a lot of damage to a person one way or other..Can last a lifetime..Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3915987055785965548.post-78790837292134140132009-01-26T00:07:00.000-08:002009-01-26T00:07:00.000-08:00Do not like the sound of this at all.Do you think ...Do not like the sound of this at all.Do you think it is ok? from any perspective.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3915987055785965548.post-44083461603776632652009-01-25T21:08:00.000-08:002009-01-25T21:08:00.000-08:00"I see a new group of Bahais in Iran were arrested..."I see a new group of Bahais in Iran were arrested a day or two ago..."<BR/><BR/>Do you consider this a good thing or a bad thing, Anonymous? <BR/><BR/>The Qur'an also says that persecution is worse than murder.Susan Maneckhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12808387897564447194noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3915987055785965548.post-30023768158806634212009-01-25T18:15:00.000-08:002009-01-25T18:15:00.000-08:00Koran5:51 tells me that muslims are not to take Ch...Koran5:51 tells me that muslims are not to take Christians,or Jews as friends.Let alone accepting Bahai Faith as a later revelation.<BR/> This is a strong message for them to remain apart.Is this what you have in mind..I see a new group of Bahais in Iran were arrested a day or two ago...Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3915987055785965548.post-82724323608597379882009-01-25T15:11:00.000-08:002009-01-25T15:11:00.000-08:00Dear Anonymous, Care to share with us your underst...Dear Anonymous, <BR/><BR/>Care to share with us your understanding of Koran 51:51? <BR/><BR/>This, of course, would be the Baha'i position: <BR/><BR/>Whatsoever hath led the children of men to shun one another, and hath caused dissensions and divisions amongst them, hath, through the revelation of these words, been nullified and abolished.<BR/><BR/> (Baha'u'llah, Gleanings from the Writings of Baha'u'llah, p. 94)<BR/><BR/><BR/>warmest, SusanSusan Maneckhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12808387897564447194noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3915987055785965548.post-82080786758368118572009-01-25T14:16:00.000-08:002009-01-25T14:16:00.000-08:00Koran 5:51Koran 5:51Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3915987055785965548.post-55298868993770169362009-01-25T08:27:00.000-08:002009-01-25T08:27:00.000-08:00Excellent post, Susan. I hope to see more from a s...Excellent post, Susan. I hope to see more from a scholar so well-educated in comparative religion.<BR/><BR/>AdibAdibMhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16837875423384399173noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3915987055785965548.post-39239344814726384002009-01-25T07:52:00.000-08:002009-01-25T07:52:00.000-08:00Heh. Susan beat me too it. ;)Heh. Susan beat me too it. ;)Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11149956661907218421noreply@blogger.com